High F#

[Claiken]

holy crap is this note freakin hard!!! Ive played it a million times before, but in the context of this piece its SO hard, because the notes before and after it dont take as much air, but that note needs like, TONS.

is it normal for this note to need THAT MUCH air??? i feel like im using all of my air for that note! why couldnt they have just added an extra key or something instead of having to try for a near impossible harmonic?? it almost sounds clearer to finger a b natural but hit an F#.... ugh. i HATE this note......


sorry, just had to vent a little frusteration!!

[flutepicc06]

holy crap is this note freakin hard!!! Ive played it a million times before, but in the context of this piece its SO hard, because the notes before and after it dont take as much air, but that note needs like, TONS.

is it normal for this note to need THAT MUCH air??? i feel like im using all of my air for that note! why couldnt they have just added an extra key or something instead of having to try for a near impossible harmonic?? it almost sounds clearer to finger a b natural but hit an F#.... ugh. i HATE this note......


sorry, just had to vent a little frusteration!!

The volume of air shouldn't need much adjustment, but the pressure, and thus speed of the airstream may. If you readjust your thinking to using a slightly smaller aperture (to increase pressure and speed) rather than simply blowing your brains out, you'll probably get better results. With diligent practice, you'll notice that F#3, E3, G#3, and the other troublesome notes in the third octave become much more reliable.

On a side note, some flute makers offer a Brossa F#, which is essentially like a Split E intended to make F#3 easier. It's very rare, not particularly useful or necessary, and only found on top of the line flutes, but it does exist.

[Claiken]

holy crap is this note freakin hard!!! Ive played it a million times before, but in the context of this piece its SO hard, because the notes before and after it dont take as much air, but that note needs like, TONS.

is it normal for this note to need THAT MUCH air??? i feel like im using all of my air for that note! why couldnt they have just added an extra key or something instead of having to try for a near impossible harmonic?? it almost sounds clearer to finger a b natural but hit an F#.... ugh. i HATE this note......


sorry, just had to vent a little frusteration!!

The volume of air shouldn't need much adjustment, but the pressure, and thus speed of the airstream may. If you readjust your thinking to using a slightly smaller aperture (to increase pressure and speed) rather than simply blowing your brains out, you'll probably get better results. With diligent practice, you'll notice that F#3, E3, G#3, and the other troublesome notes in the third octave become much more reliable.

On a side note, some flute makers offer a Brossa F#, which is essentially like a Split E intended to make F#3 easier. It's very rare, not particularly useful or necessary, and only found on top of the line flutes, but it does exist.

after a while in my practise session (i kinda felt like an idiot practising 2 bars for the better part of 45 minutes, but anyway) i did notice that if i made my lip hole smaller, it did help, but i didnt know if this was right. my teacher always tells me 'open up' and 'dont squish your lips', and i wasnt sure if by doing that i was squishing/closing up. after a while i did try something a former teacher showed me (that i happened to remember about) and i just said "puh" on that note (and it came out nicely), so that i knew what size my lips should be on that note..... it seemed to help, but theres still some fuzz before the note comes out clearly....

i know im being harsh on myself... but i need to be. i need to be perfect. they wont accept me any other way.

[flutepicc06]

after a while in my practise session (i kinda felt like an idiot practising 2 bars for the better part of 45 minutes, but anyway) i did notice that if i made my lip hole smaller, it did help, but i didnt know if this was right. my teacher always tells me 'open up' and 'dont squish your lips', and i wasnt sure if by doing that i was squishing/closing up. after a while i did try something a former teacher showed me (that i happened to remember about) and i just said "puh" on that note (and it came out nicely), so that i knew what size my lips should be on that note..... it seemed to help, but theres still some fuzz before the note comes out clearly....

i know im being harsh on myself... but i need to be. i need to be perfect. they wont accept me any other way.

Sometimes you have to practice 2 bars for 45 minutes in order to get it down. I think we've all been there (I know I have). Whatever it takes to get the best performance...There's no shame in that kind of thing.

As for what your teacher is saying, she probably means to keep your airway free and open, and not to add tension to your embouchure. If you didn't adjust the size of your aperture, you'd have very little (if any) control over what you were getting out of the instrument. I'm certain she's not telling you not to make these kinds of adjustments (if she is, I would be very concerned).

The reason there's some fuzz before the note speaks clearly is probably because you've eliminated the tongue when you were "puh-ing." Toss it back into the equation with the proper embouchure and airstream, and you should have no problem.

As for that last bit, perfection is something any serious player shoots for, but be sure not to sacrifice musical perfection for technical perfection, and don't stress yourself out too much over this audition. If you crack one note, it's not the end of the world. Play musically, and they'll probably overlook the little things. Stressing yourself out over one F#3 isn't likely to help your overall performance, anyway. Keep aiming for perfection, but realize that rarely (if ever) does anyone have a perfect audition...There's almost always something you wish you had done better, even if you hit all the notes. Don't put the emphasis on being "accepted," but on doing your best, and growing as a musician because of all the work you put in. If you happen to get the spot, great! If not, there will be plenty of other opportunities, and you can learn from this audition, regardless of the result.

[dayz]

Sometimes you have to practice 2 bars for 45 minutes in order to get it down. I think we've all been there (I know I have).

I've also been in a similar situation with the dreaded F#3 and other evil notes/evil passages. What I do to help, instead of constantly playing the 2 bars over and over the same way, I play it backwards, or change the the rhythm by playing the notes in triplets etc. Once I have played it a few times in these different ways, I play the passage the correct way and 9 times out of 10 I can play the evil notes, phrases a lot better.

[pied_piper]

You might want to think of playing the flute in the third (and fourth) octave as being very similar to an athlete training for the pole vault. It takes time to build up the muscles to make the tallest vaults. Just think of it as a progression and repetition. Athletes do lots of different strength building exercises before they attempt to move the bar up another notch. It's very similar for the flute. If you work the basics - scales leading up to that range, etc. - you'll find that it will get easier to soar to new heights.

Also, on a lighter note (no pun intended), to further extend the athlete/musician analogy here is a humorous story I heard a long time ago. This sort of brings new meaning to the comments from flutepicc06 about perfection. It shows that musicians are held to a higher standard than athletes.

In baseball, if a pro player has a .350 batting average, they are considered a superstar. Stop and think about what that really means: they are missing the ball 65% of the time. If a pro musician were to miss 65% of the notes they tried to play, he/she wouldn't have their job very long!

[Claiken]

Don't put the emphasis on being "accepted," but on doing your best, and growing as a musician because of all the work you put in. If you happen to get the spot, great! If not, there will be plenty of other opportunities, and you can learn from this audition, regardless of the result.

thats the part that impossible for me to think of that way. i dont consider auditions good situations regardless of result, and thats just why. 4 auditions, and 4 rejections... its impossible for me to think of them as being good, even if i dont get in. if they reject me again, obviously i suck. ive already come to terms with that, ebcause the people who were born playing their flute have no problems getting in, but theyve got like 15+ years on me. of course theyre gonna get in.

its kinda rediculous anyway, im paying for my education, they should let me in even if i do suck/or am just not amazingly great yet - theyre getting paid! its not like theyre donating their time for free to teach me (once i get in)... its in my tuition!

i can see the auditions for the ensembles making sense, because they dont want crappy players performing - fair enough. but we should just be able to walk in and say "I want to learn the flute" and they be like "ok your in!" because after all, they are getting paid. the audition should be more of a 'where are you at right now?' rather than 'are you the weakest link?'

[pied_piper]

i dont consider auditions good situations regardless of result, and thats just why. 4 auditions, and 4 rejections... its impossible for me to think of them as being good, even if i dont get in. if they reject me again, obviously i suck. .... its kinda rediculous anyway, im paying for my education, they should let me in even if i do suck/or am just not amazingly great yet - theyre getting paid! its not like theyre donating their time for free to teach me (once i get in)... its in my tuition!

From your 4 auditions/rejections, have you gone back and asked them to tell you why? Here are some questions you might ask:

What are the weaknesses that caused me to be rejected?
If I can improve those weaknesses, would you reconsider me?
Would you consider admitting me on a probationary basis and/or non-credit basis so that I can benefit from your program and follow your suggestions for improvement?

Another possibility is to check with the flute instructor to see if you can study privately with the goal in mind to improve your abilities so that you could be admitted to their program.

Also, don't look at your rejections as "I suck". Everything is relative. Admissions are competitive and it may be that you were competing against a batch of extremely talented flutists. Colleges and universities generally have a fixed number of openings for students. If they had 10 openings and you came in 11th, you don't get in even though you might be a good player. It might have been that there was an unusually large number of flute candidates and there simply was not room to fit you into the flute instructors schedule.

Take the rejections as a lessons learned experience and use it to direct your energy into fixing your weak spots.

[fluteguy18]

Claiken: I am sorry to be blunt, but this is the most honest response and advice I can give on your auditions/rejections. Don't neccessarily take this as a harsh, flaming, or insulting answer, but here are the straight facts from my perspective.

[in reference to your previous post that quoted flutepicc]. Nothing is impossible. You control how you think and feel. Come to terms with how you are feeling, and then change those feelings.

If you keep such a poor attitude, then you will never get in. Everyone here knows your pain. I myself have had 4 rejections in the past year, but yet I am not sulking. Your attitude comes across in your playing. No conductor wants a pessimistic musician in the ensemble. So be optimistic. Dont neccessarily set your goals on "getting in." That is a superficial goal that in the long run gets us nowhere. You need to set your goals on improving as a musician. Yes, you have less training. Yes, you are behind. Just because you haven't had the same opportunities doesnt mean that you should get special treatment [example: an adult beginner should NOT be admitted into the Boston Symphony just because they have had less training opportunites]. While I have been playing for about 10 years, I have only had 1.75 years of lessons. But, I am still being measured against those who have had 15+ years of lessons.

So, toughen up. Acknowledge that you are coming in from behind, and get a grip on what are realistic goals. You are going to be judged against everyone in the same catagory/age level that you are in, and many of them have far more experiance than you do. In all honesty, the judges want everyone to do their personal best, but the truth is, is that they don't care how much training you have had. They only have room for the best ___ [insert number] players. They are going to take from those auditions the specific individuals who played at the highest level of expertise. They are being paid as ensemble directors to produce the highest quality ensemble possible.

Thus, just work harder. You are behind, so deal with it. You just have to work twice as hard to make up for lost ground. Yes, you need ensemble experiance. But, you need to be playing at a certain level to get into those ensembles.

Keep in mind that this reply is not to make you feel badly. I have no such intention, but rather to give you the most accurate response possible. I do not know your age, so I am addressing you like one of my peers/colleagues or someone older. I understand and feel your pain. For my educational level I too am behind in experiance. But, I am making up for that by practicing like a madman. Because I have worked so hard in the past two years, I am now working on Graduate school level material, and I have passed all of the flutists in my University by means of playing quality.

I want you to succeed. I want you to be the best musician you can be. But, in order to do that, you need to accurately look at the situation at hand so that you can make honest, realistic goals.

[Claiken]

i think people are misreading me... i am upset about the rejections yes - and i do think of 'getting in' as my current goal (as in, accepted to the music program at school, im arts undeclared right now. and only the 1st 2 years are the same, and im halfway thru second year, so realistically, ive only got 1 more shot if this 1 doesnt go well).

BUT, i dont sit around and sulk all the time. when im practising im just concerned with getting better. i dont ever talk to my teachers as 'why cant all of the rules bend for me?'. especially the one im trying to impress. im open minded about this next audition........

however, i was open minded about the last one too, and it got me noplace. on the advice of my teacher i played a very challenging piece, that even she, a 1st year grad student, could not sightread smoothly (just to give a difficulty spectrum). so, did i screw up last audition? lots!! but i thought that they would be impressed with me 'taking a risk' and playing a challenging piece, rather than playing an easy boring piece perfectly.... but, no dice.

so this time, my piece are neither extremly hard, nor easy, theyre in the middle. theyre where i should be at right now.

i know im supposed to think of an audition as a growing upportunity even if i dont get in... but i am literally running out of time... this is why im so stressing on 'getting in'. i dont know what im going to do if 3rd year rolls around and im still not accepted. i will be behind creditwise by 4 already (lessons = a credit). and after 2nd year you need a certain degree title to get into classes you need.

so, see where im coming from now? after the comments i got after playing for a previous teacher after he hasnt heard me for a year & 1/2, i do feel good about my progress. its just that i am on a timeline and if i have the same luck again, i will literally be stuck having wasted 2 years of time and tuition. and lesson money, and accompanist fees... the list goes on.

i know that if my teacher saw my playing with a negative attitude she would correct me about it. she has even told me before (because i asked her after my last unsuccessful audition) that i dont suck - if i did she owuld let me down gently but she would tell me. she sees my potential. thats gotta count for something.

[fluttiegurl]

again, don't take this a rude, but have you considered changing teachers? You said that your teacher is a first year grad student. That is wonderful, but is there someone available with more experience who can guide you through your auditions a little better? If you trult feel as if you are not getting any better, it is very possible that you may need a change. Just a suggestion.

[Claiken]

again, don't take this a rude, but have you considered changing teachers? You said that your teacher is a first year grad student. That is wonderful, but is there someone available with more experience who can guide you through your auditions a little better? If you trult feel as if you are not getting any better, it is very possible that you may need a change. Just a suggestion.

$ is a factor too though... sure i could find another teacher, for $50 a pop, we cant afford that, we can barely afford the $32 an hour... with my illness mentioned in another theread somewhere (i forget at the moment) I cant work enough to pay them all myself, so i am getting help from my parents. thats another big plus about getting in, free lessons with the would be $50 a pop teacher (well, included in tuition, as a class - not besides like right now). its too late right now to think about switching anyway, i mean, my audition is Jan 7th.

i guess i am just really hoping i have a change in luck. ive had horrible luck the past 3 years with getting sick and only learning about the flute late... i HOPE with the come of the new year, and my audition in that new year, that something, somehow, will finallly change for the better (things have changed these past couple years, but only for the worse... not just with me, my whole family... its time for something somewhere to go right)

(im also hoping there is at least a woodwind on my panel... 2 pianists (like last time) arent gonna cut it... they dont have to worry about breathing, or things that might be very hard for us but easy for them they wouldnt know about/care about. their piano, as long as it is tuned properly, they are in tune. so many things they wouldnt even think about....)

[Cooeyflute]

Huge sympathies. I hope your audition goes well. On the original subject of the F sharp, you don't need too much air, just loads of support from your diaphram and those other muscles. I have trouble with F sharp too and sometimes your flute has a leak. I'm no expert though, i'm just talking from experience.

[lisaflutegirl]

Things that help me for high F # are this: make sure flute is rolled out and not in. Keep bottom lip relaxed against lip plate. Form lips in a half kiss shape,aperture"0" not "ee".Make sure lips are not pulled back as in a smiley,you want lips to be a little puckered.Lips should always be flexible from the center aperture. Make sure throat is really open and relaxed,sing high F# as you play it,tune your vocal chords to the note.keeps throat open. Blow more down into the flute hole.Use lots of abdominal support,lots of breath support. practise harmonics,it will help you find the muscles and embouchure position you need for high notes.The more relaxed you stay,the easier the high notes respond. practice lots of high note long tones.Start on B2 and slowly slur up to the higher notes one by one.Practise lots of octave shift exercises. My teacher makes me play an F#2,and then a high F#3(start on F#2 and slur up to high F#3 over and over).Toggle back and forth,keeping the face and throat relaxed as you do for the F#2. I hope this helps. Good luck, with practise, you will get it. Smiles. Lisa.