Musical Instruments, Sound Levels, and Hearing Damage

pied_piper · Post by **pied_piper** » Thu May 08, 2008 11:08 am

I originally posted this on the Galway Flute Chat in response to a question about wearing hearing protection (ear plugs) while playing/practicing piccolo. Since this is a rather important topic, I thought this might be of interest to some of you...
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Hearing damage occurs when you are exposed to high sound levels over time. Note that I don't use the term "loud" in my discussion because loudness is the human perception of sound level. Sound level is a combination of both frequency and intensity. It's generally the higher frequencies and higher levels that cause damage. Basically, the more intense the sound level, the greater the potential for hearing loss. Likewise, the longer period of time one is exposed to high sound levels, the greater the potential for hearing loss.

Here is a link to an excellent reference that compares a variety of sounds and their potential for causing damage to your hearing:

http://www.reliabilitydirect.com/RDISto ... lChart.pdf

I found this really helpful to understand and compare the risk of hearing damage. It mentions a variety of sounds and includes a number of musical instruments including the piccolo. The comparison shows the sound level in decibels (DB), which is the unit of measure for sound intensity. In particular, it states that the piccolo can vary from 90-106DB. By way of comparison, it's interesting to note that at 3 feet (1 meter) from a power mower, the sound level is 107 DB. It further shows that at a level of 105DB, one hour is the maximum permissible duration with no hearing protection. However, it also states in the notes that "High frequency sounds of 2-4,000 Hz are the most damaging. The uppermost octave of the piccolo is 2,048-4,096 Hz."

If you consider a symphony orchestra, the sound level can reach 120 - 137dB at it's peak intensity. Amplified rock music can reach 120 - 150 DB. Also, consider that ear pain is caused by sounds in excess of 125 DB, so there is a significant potential for damage from excessive exposure when the ears are unprotected from such sound sources.

Phineas · Post by **Phineas** » Fri May 09, 2008 11:15 am

This would be a good addition to the Flute FAQ Thread!

Thanks PP

Phineas

pied_piper · Post by **pied_piper** » Fri May 09, 2008 12:13 pm

Yes, that would be great for the FAQ!

After my original posting, Larry Krantz posted some additional links to his website that provides even more info:

Flutes & Piccolos Could Harm Your Hearing
by Steven A Wicks
http://www.larrykrantz.com/flutesor.htm

ARTICLE FROM THE GLOBE AND MAIL,
TORONTO, SATURDAY, MAY 18, 1996
** A classical loss of hearing **
** While modern mythology has demonized rock 'n' roll as **
** the great deafener, research suggests that symphony **
** orchestra players risk more hearing **
** problems than their heavily amplified musical brethren **
BY STEPHEN STRAUSS, Science reporter, Toronto
http://www.larrykrantz.com/hearing.htm

Getting my new earplugs
by Kathy Russell
http://www.larrykrantz.com/hearing.htm#getplugs

Bob

etgohomeok · Post by **etgohomeok** » Sat May 10, 2008 8:31 am

Sounds like people are over-analyzing things and forming bogus conspiracy theories to me.

*Waits for someone to start argument*

pied_piper · Post by **pied_piper** » Sat May 10, 2008 8:02 pm

Oh dear...

Phineas: Looks like its time to restock on the troll repellent...

etgohomeok · Post by **etgohomeok** » Sat May 10, 2008 9:20 pm

I'm not a troll, that's my opinion on the issue. If all you want is for people to agree with you, then there's no point.

pied_piper · Post by **pied_piper** » Sat May 10, 2008 10:28 pm

etgohomeok wrote:*Waits for someone to start argument*

Well, statements like that are not conducive to a civil, intelligent discussion.

You are entitled to your opinion and like any other member of this group, you are certainly welcome to participate in the discussion (pro or con) of any thread. It just seems that your interests lie more in attempting to stir things up rather than engaging in a discussion or debate.

I don't expect that everyone will agree with everything that I post. Healthy discussion and lively debate are good. If you are not trolling, then please just ease up on the attitude a little bit... You'll earn far more respect from the group participants in the long run.

Now, with respect to the original topic, it is hardly controversial, but to respond to your opinion, hearing loss and other hearing impairments such as tinnitus, are real risks for musicians. See this thread: http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/Ga ... sage/19023

My post was simply to provide some information to the group participants. It's sort of like the Surgeon General's warning on cigarettes: Anyone reading it can agree or disagree and heed or ignore the risks - it's your choice.

etgohomeok · Post by **etgohomeok** » Sun May 11, 2008 9:35 am

I put that at the bottom in reference to another topic about piano playing in which people argued with me because I disagree. Like you said, these issues are hardly controversial and I totally agree that people need to lighten up.

Anyways, what I think is, if you can't play the piccolo without wearing earplugs, then don't bother.

pied_piper · Post by **pied_piper** » Sun May 11, 2008 12:09 pm

Any piccoloist can choose to play with or without earplugs. The ability to play has nothing to do with the choice to wear or not. A similar analogy can be made to driving a car with or without seatbelts.

For myself, I take a moderate approach to their usage. I do not wear earplugs all the time when playing the picc. I use them only when I'm practicing for an extended period and it involves loud, high passages. Since my practice sessions take place in a small lively room, it tends to intensify the effects and that's what I try to reduce. The human body is fairly resilient and the ears can tolerate a bit of abuse as long as they get a reasonable amount of down time in between. The evidence shows that the damage potential comes from too much intensity for too long a period of time. I don't wear them when performing, but I do choose to mitigate what I perceive to be the worst case scenarios.

So, I guess we can agree to disagree on this topic.

wulf · Post by **wulf** » Mon May 12, 2008 1:37 am

etgohomeok wrote:Anyways, what I think is, if you can't play the piccolo without wearing earplugs, then don't bother.

It isn't your single piccolo that would be the problem - it would be the brass section standing behind you, blasting your ears with continued high volumes (or the volume produced by multiple woodwind players standing around you playing fortissimo).

Wulf

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Mon May 12, 2008 8:41 am

It's simple. Loud noise causes hearing loss. Exposure to a loud noise for an extended length of time increases the possibility of damage to your ear. Piccolos can be loud. Extensive exposure to playing FFF on a piccolo can and will damage your ears.

Phineas · Post by **Phineas** » Mon May 12, 2008 10:06 am

Between working as a pro-musician for 30+ years, being an ex-pilot and working in instrustrial work environments for 25+ years, I can tell you that it takes a lot less to cause hearing loss than people think. Heck, even downtown in a big city is close to being bad for your hearing.

etgohomeok
I do not think you are a troll, however I would like to make a couple of points in your reference to "Over analysis" in the flute world.

1. I also do not play piccolo with ear plugs. But there are occasions where I hit one of those high notes and wish I had them. However when I play with a band, I wear hear plugs!

2. I have seen and heard it all. Everything from Barometric pressure effecting your tone, to only fclean flutes play well. There is a lot of science fiction out there, ESPECIALLY in the Classical flute world. Alot of the bull is a marketing gimmic, and excuses for bad performance. I am totally with you on that.

This subject does not fall into that catagory. Hearing loss is real! There are a lot of musicians, construction, and factory workers that suffer from atleast high frequency hearing loss. When I go into a factory or a machine shop, I am now required to wear hearing protection. Some corporate computer labs require hearing protection due to excessive fan noise.

fluttiegurl · Post by **fluttiegurl** » Tue May 13, 2008 6:17 am

You were a pilot?! Cool!! My husband is an AP mechanic (totally off the subject) . . . anyway to get back on track . .

I suffer from moderate hearing loss in one ear. It started in high school, when I was playing the piccolo (most likely too often with no hearing protection). I never attended loud concerts, or use earphones, etc. Heck, my HS band only had about 40 people in it. There is no definite way to tell what caused it, but I still wonder if it was the piccolo.

At this point, there is absolutely nothing I can do about it. It does make playing interesting, especially when I am on the wrong side of the ensemble

It also makes tuning a nightmare. Yes, hearing loss is real. Protect yourself if you can.

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Tue May 13, 2008 8:32 am

Because I play piccolo a lot, and I rarely use hearing protection, my left ear can certainly hear better than my right ear.

etgohomeok · Post by **etgohomeok** » Thu May 15, 2008 9:54 am

I play high parts on the piccolo every day and my hearing is fine.

What I'm saying is that, if your practice routine is that destructive to yourself, then it probably is to others, so it's better to just give up. If you're good enough, you can limit the practicing of high parts and control the volume when you do.