My new flute

MissyHPhoenix · Post by **MissyHPhoenix** » Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:07 am

I agree that when a flutist upgrades to the next level flute, whether it is ope-hole or not, it gives them a boost in morale which should result in more practice, better performance, etc. However, I don't believe it is because of the open-holes -- I think it is more a matter of moving up from a student-level beginning instrument which is very limiting, to a intermediate or pro-professional level instrument where all of a sudden the impossible seems possible. In my opinion (which is simply that, my opinion) the band directors in the US are not educated enough about the types and models of flutes and they end up giving their students erroneous advise. I know I was told that the open-hole was THE flute to upgrade to, regardless of manufacturer. So that stuck in my head for years -- i.e., that open-hole meant better. Until I started reading the discussions on here and did an experiment of my own. I play with a group on my Pearl Elegante. We had a performance coming up and it was raining like crazy. I did not want to take my new flute, so took my old student flute, which although a student flute is in very good shape. I played throughout the concert with the student flute (which is closed holes, BTW); afterward, several of the flutists I play with came up and complimented me on how nice my tone was! (Which made me wonder if I had been having a problem with intonation on my Pearl, which is another tomato altogether ..... ).

I'm sure many people will disagree with me about this, but I firmly believe that Americans are brainwashed into thinking open-hole is so much better. It's very very hard to find an upper-end flute that does NOT Have open holes, as a matter of fact (In the USA, that is! I firmly believe that some "flute snobbynish" comes into play here, too. PErhaps when it is all said and done, whatever flutes plays best for each person, open-hole or not, is the flute for you -- NOT what somebody else says you "should" be playing; and perhaps we should all refuse to allow flute snobs to look down their noses at us any more. Just because someone plays on an open-hole flute does NOT Make them a better play than someone who does not!!

Tarandros · Post by **Tarandros** » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:00 pm

Nearly all the flutes made by Theodor Boehm, the inventor of our modern system, were closed hole and this was the result of half a lifetime of acoustical research on Boehm's part.

As far as I understand, open holes were favoured by French flautists in the late 19th and early 20th century when they were moving over in large number's to Boehm's system because the open holes reminded them of the feel of the older style ring keys that they were used to on simpler system flutes.

As for the acoustical properties of open holes, I'm no scientist, but logically, I'd have thought open holes must interfere with the air stream more than closed holes, as to some extent, when the fingered keys are depressed, the air is deflected up the short chimney formed by the holes before it meets the finger pads covering them; whereas on a closed hole flute, all the pads and the discs holding them to the key cups, are closer to the circumference of the flute tube. Furthermore, the finger pads are spongy, rather than hard and reflective, and I can't think this is an ideal way of closing a hole. On the other hand, open holes must impreove the venting on the keys that aren't being pressed, which probably compensates for the acoustical interference. But this is just pure speculation on my part. Still, I'd challenge anyone to tell the difference in sound blindfold between two flutes otherwise exactly the same but with the only difference being that one has open holes and the other, closed.

At the end of the day, I think it's a case of 'you pays your money and you takes your choice'. Probably, the most compelling reason for getting an open holed flute is if you want to include contemporary music in your repertoire that includes portamentii that can only be effected with open holes. Kind regards, T.

Bo · Post by Bo » Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:23 pm

Either way it has a much better tone than my old flute, although I wouldn't give the old one away (for sentimental reasons, being my first flute, and also because for example when I go to the beach, I'd rather go with my old flute than my new one).

I thought it would be more difficult to play on a more professional flute (that's what my father had told me), but it is actually much easier because the tone "flows" better....

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:51 pm

It is more difficult to play on "handmade" instruments because it takes more control and finesse. You mentioned in another thread that you play a Yamaha 300 series. Flutes around that level are used as step up flutes before taking the dive to buy a top notch/caliber instrument. They are designed to do that (be easier to play, but give the player room to grow). If you go try a 500 series Yamaha (or higher, and other brands as well), you are dealing with a completely different beast. They seem easier to play at first, but the more you do so you realize it takes a LOT more control to play them well.

Bo · Post by Bo » Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:51 pm

Somehow I felt I couldn't express myself with the other flute. The new one, as you say, gives me more room to grow. I had reached a level with the other one where I noticed I just couldn't improve any more because it didn't allow "nuances", to express what I really "felt". They had advertised it as "perfect for the budding flutist", and that's what it is.

Bo · Post by Bo » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:58 pm

This is what the new flute sounds like (it's not me):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1IoHoJ8kTM

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Fri Sep 04, 2009 6:23 am

Hey! Listen to this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0n3n3N3SOY

Then come back and answer this question: Does the flute make the sound, or does the player? Then apply this question to the link you just gave us.

Bo · Post by Bo » Fri Sep 04, 2009 3:38 pm

Yeah, I had found that link when I wanted to buy my very first flute 2 1/2 years ago, but there was no demonstration for it.

I didn't find a demonstration for the Ashton anywhere.

I think BOTH the player and the flute are important.
I notice a tremendous difference between my first flute and the new one, and I am still the same as I was 2 weeks ago...

It all sounds so natural and effortless now....

Bo · Post by Bo » Fri Sep 04, 2009 4:37 pm

However, I agree one doesn't need a golden or platinum flute to play well.
My "intermediate" flute has basically all the features of more professional flutes and does sound REALLY nice....

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:19 pm

I think you missed the [less than subtle] point I was trying to make. It's the player that makes the sound. The instrument only helps. Ten different people can play the EXACT same flute (hand it off down the row). The result will be TEN DIFFERENT sounds. Some will be good, some will not be. True, the instrument can help HUGELY in your sound quality, but ultimately you the player are responsible. So, demonstrations of the way a flute sounds are irrelevant. You don't buy a flute with a certain tone built in, but rather you get a flute that helps YOU make a certain tone.

MathWizard · Post by **MathWizard** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 3:57 am

An amazing player like James Galway can't be applied to the situation we are talking about. He has has been playing for over 50 years, and can make any flute sound amazing. We are talking about someone who has been playing for a very short amount of time, and flute quality can make all the difference.

fluteguy18 · Post by **fluteguy18** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 9:34 am

There are other players on youtube doing the same thing. Search for them. The results are all the same. It's the player, not the instrument. Galway is no exception to this established opinion. In fact, if you listen to recordings of him over time, then compare them to recent recordings (like this one), his sound is already deteriorating. He is 70 years old. He is rapidly approaching his retirement. He has stated many times that when he can tell that his sound and playing are deteriorating, he is going to stop playing publicly.

So even though he is still a marvelous player, his sound is already diminishing, and further proves this point that I (and countless flutists before me in far more established and reputable forums than this one) widely acknowledge. It's the player not the instrument. BUT, the instrument can help. A quality instrument can help you develop your sound, but the instrument itself does not have a set type of sound. If instruments did have a built in sound, then everyone who wanted a big warm sound would buy the same flute. But it isn't that way. If I sound great on a flute, you might sound horrible on the same instrument.

Ultimately however, you are still going to sound like yourself regardless of skill level. Jim Walker tells me that every time I even mention in my lessons wanting to sound like any of my favorite players. I can be playing a Brannen or a Gemeinhardt, and I will still sound like myself. I may not sound my best on a gemmy, but the tone is still distinctly my own.