Minor scales please help me

[kflutist]

Okay so I'm just learning my minor scales which is kind of pathetic. I am currently using the IMEA scale sheet and I am having alot of trouble with the minor portion of it. I understand the concept of it but making my fingers get all of the right notes fast enough. Does anyone have any suggestions to make this any easier?

[flutepicc06]

Learn them slowly. You don't need to (and for best results, shouldn't be) trying to play them at full tilt straight off. It will take a little while to get them under your fingers just as it probably took some time to get used to majors. Since you say you understand the concept, I won't explain them, but try thinking of the natural minors as simply the relative major scale starting on the 6th degree of the scale, and the harmonic and minor versions as simply permutations of the natural minor. It should save you having to think through the entire scale while you're playing....Just focus on the few small differences.

[deina-kun]

A little bit of theory behind the minor scales helps. My director's going through the minors with us in class and this is what he told us:

To find a major scale's relative minor (relative minor, though there's a difference between the two that he didn't feel he need to get too specific with), it's two whole steps below the first note.

Natural minor has the 3rd, 6th, and 7th flattened.
Harmonic minor has the 3rd and 6th notes flattened.
Melodic minor has the 3rd notes flattened going up and the 3rd, 6th, and 7th notes flattened going down.

Knowing that helped me with minors A LOT because it gave me a mental exercise to work on. Seeing patterns in the music helps me a lot and I usually visualiz how the scales look when they're written down while I play them from memory. T&G Exercise No. 4 helped a lot with minors, too.

[kflutist]

My director last year went through the theory and it has helped some. I guess I feel like I have to learn them very quickly and have them up to speed by late summer. I know that I won't be majoring in music but I would still like to continue with it possibly as a minor. I feel so far behind because while I can play other more difficult pieces I don't have the fundementals like scales down.

[sidekicker]

To find a major scale's relative minor (relative minor, though there's a difference between the two that he didn't feel he need to get too specific with), it's two whole steps below the first note.

Actually, this is not a correct way to find the relative minor scale/key. The relative minor begins on the sixth note of a major scale. For instance, to find the relative minor of B-flat major, one could play a B-flat major scale up to G; G, then, is the first note of the relative minor (in other words, the relative minor key for B-flat is g minor, keeping the same key signature as B-flat).

Your director's system (going "two whole steps below the first note") to find the beginning of the relative minor will lead you to the wrong note to begin a minor scale for that key signature. It is not two whole steps below going in that direction; it's actually 1/2 step plus one whole step below. The system you are using would result in a-flat being the relative minor key of C major, which is incorrect (it is a minor).

Using the sixth note of the major scale will always lead you to the correct relative minor and, IMO, is always the best system once you know all your major scales correctly.

SK

[ick27]

I think by "whole steps", deina-kun means scale degrees.
For example, to find the relative minor of C major, you could count up to the sixth scale degree (C D E F G A) or you could count down two scale degrees (C B A). The interval from A to C is actually a minor third (a half step between C and B and a whole step between B and A).

I do think about counting down two scale degrees to get to the relative minor, partly because it's easier than counting up a sixth, but also because you actually play the descending minor third a lot in T&G #4 (in the transitions from major to minor).

[sidekicker]

I think by "whole steps", deina-kun means scale degrees.

Probably so. But because this particular topic appears in our "intermediate" section of this board where a fair share of the readers fall into younger ages, I thought it best to clear that up so it doesn't confuse other people. "Whole step" (and "half step") is a musical term of art normally learned rather early, and it means a specific thing. When that term was used in the context it was, an incorrect method was given.

I don't disagree that it may be easier to go down a minor third interval to find the correct relative minor key. However, not everyone has the T&Gs or a private teacher to assist them in distinguishing what those intervals are. I was just trying to provide the simplest method for those who already have a decent concept of at least what a major scale is, but who may not yet understand or be confronted with other terms of art normally learned later, i.e. "minor third".

Just trying to be helpful and avoid confusion.

SK

[kflutist]

Umm... I have a question... Several people have mentioned the T&G, what is it/ are they?

[flutepicc06]

Umm... I have a question... Several people have mentioned the T&G, what is it/ are they?

They are the books of exercises written by Taffanel and Gaubert (both very famous flutists of the past), and are among some of the most common exercises that flutists have in their library. Until Trevor Wye put out his books, the T&G were practically a flutist's bible.

[sidekicker]

We're referring to the (Paul)Taffanel & (Philippe) Gaubert 17 Big Daily Exercises for the Flute ("17 Grands Exercices Journaliers de Mecanisme"). I think it is still only published by Alphonse Leduc. It is an excellent technique-building repertoire addition that probably every flutist should acquire at some point.

SK

[Phineas]

When you play a major scale, you are already playing minor scales depending where you start.

C-D-E-F-G-A-B C Major

D-E-F-G-A-B-C D Minor(Dorian)

E-F-G-A-B-C-D E Minor(Phrygian)

A-B-C-D-E-F-G A Minor(Aeolean or Relative or Natural Minor)

Slight modification of the A Minor Scale

A-B-C-D-E-F-G# A Harmonic(Think of it as an A major scale with a C and F natural)

A-B-C-D-E-F#-G# A Melodic (Think of it as an A major scale with a C natural)

[finallyflute-ing]

Learn them slowly. You don't need to (and for best results, shouldn't be) trying to play them at full tilt straight off. It will take a little while to get them under your fingers just as it probably took some time to get used to majors.

Amen to that advice. When learning basics, always take them slow and meticulously. Make sure you absolutely know them by heart before you move on, because everything else is based off of them.

[kflutist]

yeah ive started to slow it down and it is helping. but every so often i get very panicky because when I go to college in the fall i feel like I'm going to be so very behind everyone else.