need help possibly buying new flute

[starcycle]

Hi flute players -

I have this old flute I just dug out of the closet that I've been playing for a couple weeks. It's so tarnished that I'm not even sure what kind it is, but it says silver head on the head piece. I think it's an old armstrong. I got it in some junk store about 15 years ago for $50.

I have no formal training on the flute, but I really enjoy just picking it up and just playing stuff: e.g., jazz, latin, stereolab, somafm, etc. I can get nice tonalities -- though I am perhaps constitutionally/permanently limited in the upper ranges (or maybe it's just the flute, or improper technique, etc.). People generally seem to say it sounds pretty good, though. I'm actually a guitarist, but I developed carpal tunnel and can't really play that much now until it heals, so I was going crazy and then I came across the flute I forgot I even had. It doesn't seem to affect the wrists at all, so I thought I might go ahead and try to get better.

Here's some of my questions though. Everything feels pretty natural as far as fingerings, but I noticed the low F intonation is pretty out of whack. I was compensating easily enough by tilting the flute, etc. but I was concerned about developing that as a bad habit. So I used an online tuner to find out exactly what was going on, and I was shocked to discover that *it's actually been tuned down a half step the whole time!*

I adjusted it to concert pitch as best I could, but tuned that way it sounds totally out of whack. All the fingerings feel a little weird, too, but I guess I would just get used to the correct ones if I got a proper flute. But I'm wondering -- this is likely just the result of a junky flute, right? I mean the intervals seem totally wrong and it has none of the same resonance or naturalness to it. Every note is just slightly out of kilter. Whereas except for that low F (which isn't even really that bad) it actually sounds spot on perfect -- and even really nice, actually -- when it's tuned a half step lower. Is that common with flutes, or am I misunderstanding something about their natural pitch and how they should be tuned, or what? It's so bad that I immediately just moved it back to where it was and am continuing to use it that way for now.

The next thing is that in considering a new flute, the problem is 1) I would definitely not like to "downgrade" from a silver head to plated, even as junky and out of whack as this flute may be, it still has pretty nice sonorous tones, especially in the low registers, but 2) I don't feel that I'm really good enough (or dedicated/disciplined enough, etc.) to warrant spending $500 or more on a good intermediate flute (I really want one of those silver head pearl quantzes -- 665, I think it is, or something comparable, jupiter maybe, etc). I just want to improv and play jazz, etc. and have it sound good, without spending past my limited abilities.

So the question is: what should I do? Would a lower entry level silver plated flute still probably be better than this old beat up armstrong, even thought it's got the silver head? I'm all about the TONE and I really can't get the same enjoyment with thinner or less dynamic tone. On the other hand, realistically I probably will never practice scales, etc. or really dedicate myself to practicing formally. Once my wrists heal I'll resume the jazz guitar studies again, and all my music energy will likely be focused there. I'm just interested in flute improvising and jamming, and hopefully developing improv technique that way, more informally. I just don't know if I can justify spending $500-1000 for what I actually want, or if a more basic entry flute (like the pearl quantz 505s) would be "good enough" and not a tone downgrade from the silver head.

thanks for reading all that. thought I would just lay it all out for the experienced people to get a sense of the whole picture and be able to make a recommendation. appreciate any comments or advice.

[pied_piper]

It's hard to say exactly what model you have, but it might be a Model 80. Those came with a sterling silver head and body - the keys are plated.

Have you tried another flute or asked another flutist to try yours? That would be the easiest way to figure out if it's you or the instrument.

Regarding your low F intonation, your flute probably needs a checkup at the repair shop since it's been sitting unused. Can you play any notes below the low F? Lots of things can need adjusting or possibly some pads need replacing to get everything working properly. Leaky pads and improper adjustments can make playing the flute truly difficult. Also, if the instrument seems out of tune with itself, the headjoint cork is probably set in the wrong position or it could be dried and leaking.

Assuming the flute is not physically damaged, asking for a repair technician to put it in playing shape could be as trivial a a single small adjustment or it could need a complete repad. Ask for an estimate. You might get by for under $50, but you might want to consider a COA (Clean, Oil and Adjust) or a complete repad. That might be around $150-$200, but the flute would play like new (when done by a good shop).

Armstong is no better and no worse than other comparable instuments. I played a Model 80 for many years and I still keep it as a backup instrument. While it's not a top end flute, it is pretty solid and reliable when everything is in good order.

[starcycle]

It's hard to say exactly what model you have, but it might be a Model 80. Those came with a sterling silver head and body - the keys are plated.

Have you tried another flute or asked another flutist to try yours? That would be the easiest way to figure out if it's you or the instrument.

Regarding your low F intonation, your flute probably needs a checkup at the repair shop since it's been sitting unused. Can you play any notes below the low F? Lots of things can need adjusting or possibly some pads need replacing to get everything working properly. Leaky pads and improper adjustments can make playing the flute truly difficult. Also, if the instrument seems out of tune with itself, the headjoint cork is probably set in the wrong position or it could be dried and leaking.

Assuming the flute is not physically damaged, asking for a repair technician to put it in playing shape could be as trivial a a single small adjustment or it could need a complete repad. Ask for an estimate. You might get by for under $50, but you might want to consider a COA (Clean, Oil and Adjust) or a complete repad. That might be around $150-$200, but the flute would play like new (when done by a good shop).

Armstong is no better and no worse than other comparable instuments. I played a Model 80 for many years and I still keep it as a backup instrument. While it's not a top end flute, it is pretty solid and reliable when everything is in good order.

Thanks for the response. I think it's actually a model 100, as among all the oxidation there's a 100 visible on it ( ). But that's what led me to track down the idea that it's an armstrong. I found a couple around on the web, one on ebay, and they look just like mine, so I think that's definitely it. The 100 has silver head only, btw, the body is plated. Would that change your opinion at all?

All the notes play, it's just sometimes when you hit that low F it's a little flat. I only notice it on certain songs, strangely enough. The cork is really dried out, maybe that's contributing. It turns out it shouldn't even be F in the song anyway but E.

I guess I could just get this repaired, that's a good idea. I didn't know if it would be worth it, but if the quality is going to end up at least as good as a new, non-silver headed, that might be the way to go. thanks!

[Dusk]

I'm not sure about their really old stuff, but Armstrong's current 100 series (102, 103, 104...) is their beginner line. I'm pretty sure that they're all silver plated flutes, so the headjoint might be aftermarket. As to the actual quality of the flute, I currently play on an Armstrong 104, and I can say without doubt that they are solidly built flutes that are definitely underrated. I would definitely recommend having a more experienced player check it out for you to determine if it requires repairs. If possible you might want to consider playing on it-- if it's in good enough shape-- and upgrading to a significantly better flute when you absolutely need to. This would save you the cost of multiple upgrades. Good luck!

[fluttiegurl]

The 100 was a precursor to today's 102, 103 & 104 series.

In truth, modern flutes tend to be much easier to deal with. The 100 Armstrongs were still considered student flutes (even with the solid silver heads). If you were to purchase say an intermediate plated modern flute, you are probably going to still have better results. For instance, the cut of the headjoint has been improved as well as the scale having definitely been improved.

If you are just wanting to play around, by all means, have your worked on. It probably needs pads as well as adjustment since it has been setting around for a long time. The headjoint cork is probably out of whack as well. That alone could fix your intonation problems. If you are serious and plan to play with any groups, get a newer flute. It will make your life much easier in the long run.

One word of caution. Wrist problems are somewhat common among flute players as well. One of the biggest issues that I see is when a player uses pressure from the fingers to compensate for leaky pads. Since you already have problems, a re-pad is definitely something to seriously consider.

[Dusk]

Are you sure that you were playing the right note to tune with? Many tuners probably expect a C to be a concert Bb, or another similar change. I think you should double check that possibility. Also, it could be your computer's microphone that is the problem. You can't rule out things other than the flute itself.