A question for those who own or have played gold flutes

[cflutist]

As some of you know, I currently play a 14K Rose Gold Williams headjoint with a 1972 (old scale, A=440) Haynes Flute with an inline-G and a Split E and C# trill added at a later date.

Was pondering if I should look into getting a 14K body/foot to match.

Was thinking either Brannen (have read good things about them here) or having Mr.Williams make it.

Talked to Carolyn Nussbaum (she services my flute) and she recommended silver keys due to the weight and someone here I think recommended the gold tone holes.

I have several questions:

1 - would I even be able to tell a difference when using the same 14K HJ with different flute bodies? I best describe myself as an adult amateur who during my younger years was a serious player with a scholarship at the SF Conservatory of Music's Preparatory Dept (for high school students) and have performed in the past (not now) the Dutilleux Sonatine, Prokofieff Sonata, Schubert Variations etc. By no means even close to a Professional.

2 - would you recommend Brannen? Williams? one of Carolyn's workers recommended Miyazawa? Carolyn did say that Haynes and Powell have fallen out of favor a bit.

3 - I assume the scale would be much improved from the 1972 Haynes (pre-Deveau) one? Also the A-442 would come in handy as the community orchestra that I play Principal flute in tends to play sharp and by the end of the rehearsal the bassoonist is telling the conductor he can't push in anymore (we still tune to A=440).

4 - everyone is recommending an off-set G for ergonomic reasons. Do you think I would be able to switch from an inline-G to an offset-G easily? I've played inline-G since 1972. Carolyn has serviced my Inline-G with Split-E wonderfully, but I think offset -G would be better in the future?

Sorry to ask so many questions, but this would be a special order (without an headjoint), and I would be purchasing blindly without being able to test it out beforehand ... guess it couldn't be worse than when I ordered the Haynes back in 1972, waited 6 months while they made the flute and then shipped it to me and it was mine.

Thanks in advance for your help.

p.s. SK, I sent you an email and tried PM here but it is disabled.

[fluteguy18]

1. Yes. Even though the headjoint is a big part of the sound, the body still makes up a large portion of the sound as well. Tonehole material does make a difference (although I find gold toneholes difficult to articulate on, but they have great color).

2. Any of those companies would be great. Really, just about any company that makes high grade flutes (those mentioned plus Pearl, Sankyo, Nagahara, Muramatsu, Altus, Burkhart, Lopatin, Landell, Tom Greene, Parmenon, and more) will be suitable. Haynes has fallen from favor because they have lost the trust of their customers in regards to where their instruments are made. Powell is still widely endorsed, but they seem diminished in favor because there are TONS of reliable brands out there. 'Back in the day' Haynes and Powell were the only two worth getting, and therefore they seemed legendary.

3. Yes. Scales have greatly improved since the 70's.

4. Inline/offset is a very personal choice. You have to try them out to decide which one you like. I personally feel that offset is best because it provides a more natural position.

Lastly, you won't be buying blindly if you don't want to. Companies of this caliber have clients that buy bodies only all the time. They would merely deduct the cost of the headjoint from the sale price. This is what SK did. He bought a headjoint, and then a body later. He merely tried the head with various bodies, and when he found the one he liked, he bought the body. He did however have to wait for it a few months because it was a demo flute that Brannen had. You can purchase the exact instrument you play with companies that operate like Brannen (make to order), but you have to wait for a replacement to be made so that their demo lineup doesn't have any flutes missing.

I myself am hoping to get a new flute in the next 4-5 months. HOPEFULLY. I personally have tested a lot of flutes and have found that Brannen, Nagahara, Miyazawa and Powell tend to be my favorites. If I end up having to order a flute (and it be manufactured) I plan on doing everything in my power to take the headjoint I have chosen with me when I complete the sale. Hopefully they will send the body separately without a problem. I would never buy a headjoint without testing it.

[cflutist]

Thanks FG18, I knew you would have the answers.

A friend of mine just came to a flute fest that I host at the house with his gold Brannen, it had silver keys and a convertible foot joint (but I didn't notice what material the tone holes were).

A late friend of mine (who was murdered - still hasn't gone to trial yet) had a gold Nagahara (also with silver keys) but I've heard they have a different bore diameter that might cause problems with my headjoint?
I never did get to try his flute.

Three of my past teachers all played Powell as does the second flute in our orchestra.

I'm thinking maybe I should go to a local music store and try a student flute out with an offset-G to see how quickly I can adapt. My very first student Armstrong flute in 1968 had an offset-G but that was years ago.

[fluteguy18]

With Nagahara you can use any headjoint on any of their flutes EXCEPT the "Full Concert" model. It has a different bore size (bigger), and therefore a different scale. You must use a "Full Concert" headjoint with a "Full Concert" body.

I tried the Full Concert model, and it was my favorite out of all of the Nagahara lineup. At that convention I was at (NFA-Kansas City), a 10K Full Concert and a 10K Brannen were my two favorite flutes.

[m3the01]

Ive played the Brannen silver, Gold 14k and Platinum, with a wide variety of headjoints.


They are truly amazing flutes, however the cost is very very high. There was for sure a difference between the gold headjoint on a silver flute. However, for me not enough to justify the cost. The lower register is truly amazing on the precious flutes, i think the mix between silver flute and gold headjoint is really nice. Even a platinum riser is great,



I would highly highly suggest u demo the brannen, and please demo a pearl maesta 9701, 9700, gold versions.



Good luck!!!

[cflutist]

1. Yes. Even though the headjoint is a big part of the sound, the body still makes up a large portion of the sound as well. Tonehole material does make a difference (although I find gold toneholes difficult to articulate on, but they have great color).

Lastly, you won't be buying blindly if you don't want to. Companies of this caliber have clients that buy bodies only all the time. They would merely deduct the cost of the headjoint from the sale price. This is what SK did. He bought a headjoint, and then a body later. He merely tried the head with various bodies, and when he found the one he liked, he bought the body. He did however have to wait for it a few months because it was a demo flute that Brannen had. You can purchase the exact instrument you play with companies that operate like Brannen (make to order), but you have to wait for a replacement to be made so that their demo lineup doesn't have any flutes missing.

FG18, would you please elaborate on the tone-hole matieral. I called Brannen today and they did say that the 14K tone holes do have more resistance. I'm just worrying that adding 14K to the body and tone holes might be too much resistance for me. They are suggesting the silver tone hones instead.

I also found out that they will make the body to fit my exisitng 14K Williams headjoint. And they will make in-line G with a Split E, whereas Williams will only do that on an offset G. That's good news.

But then, I might just take them up on their offer to send me some flutes. I did find out one thing though, it's just 1K per flute charged to your credit card which is refundable when you return the flute. When I did my headjoint trials 4 years ago with Carolyn Nussbaum I had to pay $17K for all three headjoints before they were went to me. Another thing I liked is that Brannen will take Credit Cards (for no surcharge fee) whereas Carolyn will NOT take Credit Cards for anything over $10K. I want my Airline Miles

[fluteguy18]

Well, I mean... there's not a whole lot that I can say about the tone materials other than my experience.

When trying gold flutes I found that the ones with gold tone holes had more resistance, and I couldn't articulate as clearly. When I tried gold flutes with silver tone holes, the tone color was a little brighter and the response to articulation was a lot clearer.

But this was just my experience. I know that other people have the opposite.

[cflutist]

Went to a local music store today to try an offset G. It just felt funny to me as both of my current flutes have inline Gs and that is all I've played since 1972. I think it might be a little confusing to my fingers to mix offset and inline Gs.

The only reason I was even considering an offset G is because Mr. Williams would not make a Split E with an inline G. Brannen said they can put a Split E with either offset or inline G.

Also, Brannen will make the barrel to fit my existing headjoint so that I could use it on either flute. They said they get requests to do that all the time.

[Zevang]

I've heard somewhere that flutes with inline G and split-E have some issues about being easily out of adjustment and fragile. I really didn't have any contact with such an instrument, but just heard about it.

Is it really essencial for you to have a split-e? Maybe you can have an inline G mechanism with that ring that close partialy the tone hole of the G key. My Sankyo works fine with this resource. They call it "NEL". Many technicians know how to manufature and install it, so it's no big deal for a brand to include it in the instrument you are ordering.

[cflutist]

I played for 30 years without a Split E. But after I had one added (along with a C# Trill) to my Haynes in 1998, it just made playing so much easier especially those ppp slurs from A3 to E3.

I haven't had any issues with a Split E with an inline-G, Carolyn Nussbaum has been servicing my Haynes just fine.

I've also read that the G-Insert aka "donut" can flatten A1 and A2.

Zevang - Java eh? I've noticed lots of IT (techie) folks on this board.

[fluttiegurl]

Did Carolyn add your split E? I may be interested in this.

[pied_piper]

I've noticed lots of IT (techie) folks on this board.

cflutist - Count me as a techie/musician, too.

[cflutist]

Did Carolyn add your split E? I may be interested in this.

No, the Haynes factory added both Split E and C# Trill in 1998.

[cflutist]

I've noticed lots of IT (techie) folks on this board.

cflutist - Count me as a techie/musician, too.

Yes I know

Interesting correlation between techies and music. In our community orchestra Principal Clarinet is PhD in Math and a scientist at Lawrence Livermore Labs (and also a FORTRAN programmer). Principal bassoon is a UNIX sys admin. Horn player is also a UNIX techie. A cello player has a PhD in Fluid Mechanics. Principal flute (that's me) was a COBOL programmer years ago but now manages Mainframe Software Development projects.

[m3the01]

May as well add to this techie spec's,
Ph.D Candidate, finishing up this Aug, Computing Science->GPGPU visualization, HIV-1 research, virtually surgery, and 3d immersive environments for MRI and CT viewing.