Muramatsu - If the EX is so good, is the DS, GX redundant?

[flutego12]

Muramatsu - If the EX is so good, what place is there for the full bodies silver DS and GX?

[pied_piper]

Some players want and are willing to pay for a silver body, some not...

[flutego12]

Some players want and are willing to pay for a silver body, some not...

[fluteguy18]

I don't believe they're redundant. Over the past year I have had the opportunity to listen to literally HUNDREDS and HUNDREDs of flute players try out flutes. I used to be in the school of thought that material made very little impact on sound and that it was 95% design and construction. I now feel that it's about 50/50 as long as the instruments being compared are quality brands. When I would do trials and it came down to Muramatsu and the same headjoint was involved, 9 times out of 10 the player went with the GX simply because the added silver of the body enhanced their sound (particularly in depth of the upper register). I personally can't tell if a flute has solid silver keys or not by listening to it in a lineup. I can however hear a certain brightness in flutes with plated bodies compared to instruments with solid bodies. I'm amazed that I am saying this now because a year ago I wouldn't have.

As for the DS model... I think with that model you're paying more for the ability to have repairs without worry of destroying any plating. From speaking with my friends in repair they feel that plated components are more difficult to adjust simply because they have to be more careful not to mar the surface. If they mar the surface of something solid silver they can easily burnish out the flaw created in the process.

As a side anecdote I have slowly come to acquire some knowledge of what flute brands/designs flatter certain kinds of players. When I step into a trial room I can usually guess which 2-3 flutes we will narrow it down to after only a few minutes.

[pied_piper]

As a side anecdote I have slowly come to acquire some knowledge of what flute brands/designs flatter certain kinds of players. When I step into a trial room I can usually guess which 2-3 flutes we will narrow it down to after only a few minutes.

Interesting observation. Could you share any details of what player/flute characteristics seem to go together?

[flutego12]

I don't believe they're redundant. Over the past year I have had the opportunity to listen to literally HUNDREDS and HUNDREDs of flute players try out flutes. I used to be in the school of thought that material made very little impact on sound and that it was 95% design and construction. I now feel that it's about 50/50 as long as the instruments being compared are quality brands. When I would do trials and it came down to Muramatsu and the same headjoint was involved, 9 times out of 10 the player went with the GX simply because the added silver of the body enhanced their sound (particularly in depth of the upper register). I personally can't tell if a flute has solid silver keys or not by listening to it in a lineup. I can however hear a certain brightness in flutes with plated bodies compared to instruments with solid bodies. I'm amazed that I am saying this now because a year ago I wouldn't have.

As for the DS model... I think with that model you're paying more for the ability to have repairs without worry of destroying any plating. From speaking with my friends in repair they feel that plated components are more difficult to adjust simply because they have to be more careful not to mar the surface. If they mar the surface of something solid silver they can easily burnish out the flaw created in the process.

As a side anecdote I have slowly come to acquire some knowledge of what flute brands/designs flatter certain kinds of players. When I step into a trial room I can usually guess which 2-3 flutes we will narrow it down to after only a few minutes.

Hi fluteguy18... lovely to hear from you. That's a fantastic piece of insight backed with corroborative empirical experiences (evidence) - exactly the type I wanted to get. Do you coach flute at college/ conservatory or do you aid procurement in a certain capacity? That was exactly my experience in the limited setting (limited ability/ limited choice) I was faced with at the flute shop. The EX I tried was discernibly airier and thinner than the GX (even with my then raw ear & embouchure) - in hindsight, had thought it might be the hj. Thanks! And yes, I'd love if you would elaborate and enlighten us on your most interesting last statement above. Could that be influenced by the types of repertoire/genre or the player profile (band v orchestra v the military, child/adult-student/amateur permutations, primary vs high school vs college, aspiring pros vs pros versus arthritic seniors/retirees ?)

[fluteguy18]

I currently work for a flute retail company and while I usually work in the sheet music department I am often pulled into the instrument trial and purchasing process.

As for my observations I will say first and foremost... only that. These things are what I have seen and I can usually guess pretty well after 2-3 flutes the person's playing style and which flutes they might like. But these are not rules, facts, nor anything other than a synthesis of the experience having heard many people play MANY MANY flutes back to back.

So... players that are shopping in the under $3k range for example. If they like a Lyric, there's a 90% chance they're going to like the Miyazawa 102 and quite likely a Trevor James or Resona. The Lyric flute is imported by the same company that does Miyazawa in the States and they are quite similar because of that. These four flutes, while all different often have similar amounts of headjoint under and over-cutting.

Players that need more control or guidance for their sound generally do well with Pearl, Muramatsu or Di Zhao. The headjoint cuts on those brands flatter them (generally speaking). A lot of times the flutists that end up purchasing those flutes tend to have a naturally brighter sound that needs more depth, and those flutes sometimes bring a fuller resonance. Players that have extreme amounts of control with their lips and embouchure however tend to be a little stuffy on those flutes. Those players tend to like flutes with less over/undercutting. Burkart flutes work well for someone with a naturally colorful sound but who is looking for clarity, and Powell and Brannen run right down the middle. Altus is a toss up to me. I can't tell whether or not someone will like it until I hear them play it. Miyazawa is a beast of its own because they have so many headjoint designs available.

Keep in mind however that these are only BROAD statements that are by no means any kind of rule or fact. These are just things that I have noticed and a person's personality and style outweigh any of these things. But, considering that I do spend a good bit of time assisting players in their purchasing process, I try to use my knowledge and personal experience with the flutes themselves along with my experiences with other customers in the past to find the right match for each flutist. So that's my disclaimer! Just observations and trends I've noticed. There are ALWAYS exceptions!

[flutego12]

@fluteguy18

Disclaimer noted as accompanies all responsible dispensations. You've made it crystal clear.
Thank you for your observations & depth of insights. They are simply priceless and much much appreciated.
The purchasing process certainly has it's empirical trends but is not an exact science as you have aptly qualified.
V interesting to know. And what a great place to be.