frustrated with progress

[Jackiep]

I am at a point in my flute playing that I am feeling somewhat frustrated with how things are going. My teacher has pointed out that although my tone is sounding good I really need to work on counting as she feels that in order to play with anyone else or even play a duet with her and the piano it is important that I learn to count out what I am playing. I practice with a book everyday (Winning Rhythms) and although it is challenging I find I can get through it if I work at it, the problem is when I actually am playing notes I find that I am overwhelmed with counting. Doted quarter notes and ties are especially difficult for me. I have been relying on listening to someone else play a song and then imitating them up until recently and it really worked (except when I tried to play with someone else...haha). I know that this is something I am just going to have to push through this but I am curious what others experience has been with learning to count while playing. Is counting something you always do (as in anytime you play)? Or do you only count in certain situations? I am trying to count even songs that I know because I am hoping that it becomes a habit after some time but I have to say it has taken some of the fun out of my flute playing.
Any insights would be appreciated

[pied_piper]

You absolutely, positively must ALWAYS count when playing. Good tone is important as is playing the correct note, but counting is essential in order to play the correct rhythm. It's even important to count even if you are only playing whole notes. Otherwise, you will not keep the correct timing with other players.

You didn't mention how long you have been playing, but it WILL get easier as you continue to develop your skills. Eventually, it will become second nature. In the beginning, yes, you have a lot of things that you have to be aware of: playing the right note, playing with a good tone, playing the correct rhythm, playing the correct tempo, and playing the correct volume. When you add in other things, like blowing, breathing, tied notes, phrasing/slurs, etc., it can be a bit overwhelming at first. Just stick with it and focus on one thing at a time.

To master counting, one thing that will help is to look for new or unusual rhythms in the music before you start to play it. Then, before you pick up your flute, count aloud and clap the rhythm instead of playing it on your flute. That way, you can ignore all of the other things while you concentrate on counting and getting the rhythm correct. If it's too hard to clap the entire song with no errors, take the first measure and clap it. Repeat until you get it right 5 times in a row. Then, clap the second measure. Repeat. Then the third, etc. Go back and clap measure one and two in sequence, then measure 1, 2, 3, etc. When you are comfortable with each measure, and all of the groups of measures, clap the entire piece. Do that until you get it correct at least 5 times in a row. If you make a mistake, start again until you can do it correctly 5 times with no error. If you try that, I think you'll start to get the hang of it much quicker. Then, pick up your flute and play the rhythm using only one note. A G is a good note to use for this. Play the rhythm on a G until you get it correct 5 times in a row. Then, try playing it as written. Using this technique will help to eliminate the feeling of being overwhelmed by all the different things that you have to do at the same same time. Now, that may sound tedious, but if you think of it as a game and if you do this faithfully, you should start to see some progress with your counting abilities and before long, you'll say to yourself, "Hey, this really isn't do difficult after all"! As you get better, you won't have to do so many repetitions and you'll find that you can look at it and play the rhythm correctly the first time.

I hope that helps!

Oh, one other thing... Do you have a metronome? If so, use it to help you keep a steady beat. If you dont have one, get one! It's a great tool to help with counting. Some have a feature to help with counting. On those you can set the time signature and it will play a beep on the first beat and a boop on the others. So 4/4 time would sound like: beep, boop, boop, boop, beep, boop, boop, boop. That way, if you miscounted, you will realize it sooner because your one count will not be in sync with the beep.

[Jackiep]

Thank you! It is very helpful to get some ideas on how to go about learning how to count while playing. I am trying to count everything and since many of the songs I know by memory I can't count in my head I now am playing only very simple songs because I can actually count the simple songs. I find this frustrating because I can play more difficult songs but I can't count them (I just know how to play them because I have heard others play them). I am dedicated to learning to count and it seems the only way to do that is to go back to the beginning and fix this.
I am also concerned because I have a friend that plays the piano and she mentioned that even though she plays very well she could never learn to count in that way. She feels that some people are just incapable of doing this because of the way there mind works. Is it possible that this is true? I am worried that no matter how hard I work at learning this I just will never be able to master counting while playing complicated pieces. I hope she is wrong because I really love the flute and would hate not to be able to play because of this.
Oh I do have a metronome but really like the idea of getting one that will help me count as well and will check into that.

[fluteguy18]

Yeah, counting and rhythm is pretty much everything... I mean... Rhythm is the only thing that keeps 'Joy To the World' from being any other major scale...

[pied_piper]

I am trying to count everything and since many of the songs I know by memory I can't count in my head I now am playing only very simple songs because I can actually count the simple songs. I find this frustrating because I can play more difficult songs but I can't count them (I just know how to play them because I have heard others play them).

When playing songs from memory, I don't think you will gain a lot by trying to learn to count them in your head. On the other hand, if you
have the printed music for any of those songs, then it WOULD help to count as you read from the printed sheet.

I am dedicated to learning to count and it seems the only way to do that is to go back to the beginning and fix this.

Dedication is the first step to conquering your problem. Don't think of it as going backwards. You already know a lot about playing notes on the flute. What you have to do is to begin to interpret the printed notes and correlate them with the notes and rhythms that you already know how to play. Now, it doesn't sound so bad if you think of it like that, does it?

I am also concerned because I have a friend that plays the piano and she mentioned that even though she plays very well she could never learn to count in that way. She feels that some people are just incapable of doing this because of the way there mind works. Is it possible that this is true? I am worried that no matter how hard I work at learning this I just will never be able to master counting while playing complicated pieces. I hope she is wrong because I really love the flute and would hate not to be able to play because of this.

Every person is a bit different. Some have an inate ability to "feel" rhythms more readily than others. She probably does not realize it, but she is counting subconsciously. In her case, conscious counting may be more of a distraction to her. Here's an example of what I mean. If you were standing several feet from the door of your house and I asked you to open that door, you would probably be able to do it in a second without even really thinking about HOW you did it. Now, if I asked you to consciously think about everything that you did to open that door, it would probably slow you down and take perhaps 2-5 seconds to do it. It would go something like this:

Lift left foot, balance on right leg, and extend left leg forward to take step toward door
Lift right foot, balance on left leg and extend right leg forward to take step toward door
Repeat above two instructions until you are close to the door
Bring right leg and foot forward until it is even with left foot
Raise right arm and hand to the height of the door knob.
Extend arm until hand touches door knob
Grasp door knob with hand
Rotate wrist clockwise and simultaneously push door open
Walk through doorway (see walking instructions 6 steps above)
Turn around and push door closed
Turn around again
Walk into house

Now I'm sure that you don't consciously think about all those tasks that you have to do to open a door, but whether you realize it or not, your brain is doing it subconsciously. With practice, reading and playing music will begin to become second nature too.

[Jackiep]

Thank you for the encouraging words.....you are right I am not going back to the beginning because I do know a lot more than most when they start

I am sure you are right that my friend does feel rhythm more easily than most and does it without realizing it. In most situations her playing is beautiful but when she plays with her husband who plays the clarinet very well and is very aware of counting very precisely he complains that her timing is off and they basically cannot play together because she plays by ear and what feels right rather than counting everything out like he does......pretty interesting.

I think eventually I will have to count everything out as my natural rhythm is not great at this point but there is always room for improvement so I will keep working on that also.

[pahudfan87]

The best thing to do is to always ALWAYS practice with a metronome! Another thing is during difficult rythms, to write in the counts in the music and say them in your head while practicing.