FEEDBACK SOUGHT: Has anyone used the JLS's Flute Station?

[flutego12]

Keen to hear if anyone has used the Flute Station from JLSmith.

[pied_piper]

I've seen it demonstrated. One could say it's the Rolls Royce of flute body repair tools. Very specialized, very pricey, very effective. It's designed to help a flute tech repair even the worst possible banana shaped flute.

The flute station is designed for a shop that does a lot of flute body work. It can make short work of straightening a flute body, but a shop has to do a lot of that type of work to justify the cost. Smaller shops that see flute body damage only occasionally can still perform those repairs using more conventional flute body mandrels, rollers, burnishers, dent hammers, etc. The flute station simply optimizes the process in a nice convenient, compact package and then also double as a versatile flute holder while doing COAs and repads.

Did you watch the video of it on the Smith website?

[flutego12]

I've seen it demonstrated. One could say it's the Rolls Royce of flute body repair tools. Very specialized, very pricey, very effective. It's designed to help a flute tech repair even the worst possible banana shaped flute.

The flute station is designed for a shop that does a lot of flute body work. It can make short work of straightening a flute body, but a shop has to do a lot of that type of work to justify the cost. Smaller shops that see flute body damage only occasionally can still perform those repairs using more conventional flute body mandrels, rollers, burnishers, dent hammers, etc. The flute station simply optimizes the process in a nice convenient, compact package and then also double as a versatile flute holder while doing COAs and repads.

Sounds most promising! Question is, how much skill must one acquire to effectively use these? A good indication is how long is the apprenticeship & how many levels are there? I am a bit of a gadget person myself but have no experience in metal works or panel beating. Be great if dent removal extends to panel beating skills. Very tempted to give it a try.

Did you watch the video of it on the Smith website?

I'll go rewatch it. Thanks Pied Piper.

[fluteguy18]

I believe that they have one of those in the repair department where I work. They seem to rarely use it preferring the older methods. They think it's useful but they seem to prefer the other ways. The most I've ever seen it used is as a flute holder when using the rotary motor to fit a headjoint cork.

[mirwa]

I have one,

It looked great when I bought it, worked great when I got it, looks beautiful, its art on its own. But as the novelty of the new toy wore off, I resorted back to my old ways of dent removal and headjoint resizing, it was just not worth getting down and setting up in a vise.

That being said it is a nice tool for those who are very space limited, or maybe even a nice tool for someone who tweaks flutes on the side, but for a repair shop, it was a worthless purchase.

I found it extremely average for straightening flute bodies.

[flutego12]

I have one,

It looked great when I bought it, worked great when I got it, looks beautiful, its art on its own. But as the novelty of the new toy wore off, I resorted back to my old ways of dent removal and headjoint resizing, it was just not worth getting down and setting up in a vise.

That being said it is a nice tool for those who are very space limited, or maybe even a nice tool for someone who tweaks flutes on the side, but for a repair shop, it was a worthless purchase.

I found it extremely average for straightening flute bodies.

There's a refreshing 36() degree perspective - thank you for your candid assessment - the FS is such clever marketing it sells an attractive kit to enthusiastic newbies and offer a glimmer of hope that perhaps we too can attempt repairs. The set up is attractive though, I'm not sure about the manual pushing and pulling of the flute tube to iron out a dent I am disappointed to hear that as I thought it is very effective. How do you mean by "average for straigthening". Perhaps that's why its Out of Stock.

Can I ask what old techniques of dent removal and hj resizing do you employ?

What do you think of the pair of Flute Blocks currently sold for $56.

[mirwa]

Again, I have them but dont use them.

I pretty much buy most tools I see from suppliers, its only through buying them do I know if it can improve me and my end product. 90 percent of the time I find the products are pretty and really of no use over convential tools. That is hammers rollers feller gauges screwdrivers etc.

Removing dents is a skill, that a simple roller wont achieve, When you work a bent side for example with a roller, you in fact stretch the metal in that plane, the stretched metal needs to be dispersed back into the flute, to achieve this you need to reverse bend with two mandrels, then you need to work areas opposite each other to equalise the stretched areas of metal, its a skill that simply rolling a bearing over a round block of steel wont replicate. The working of the metal also has to take into consideration the walls of the tone holes, the last thing you want is a ripple into a tone hole happening.

Again, my explanation is very simplified, and you should not attempt doing said process by my description alone.

[pied_piper]

... the FS is such clever marketing it sells an attractive kit to enthusiastic newbies and offer a glimmer of hope that perhaps we too can attempt repairs. The set up is attractive though, I'm not sure about the manual pushing and pulling of the flute tube to iron out a dent I am disappointed to hear that as I thought it is very effective. How do you mean by "average for straigthening". Perhaps that's why its Out of Stock.

Can I ask what old techniques of dent removal and hj resizing do you employ?

What do you think of the pair of Flute Blocks currently sold for $56.

Hmm. I guess I don't see that JL Smith is marketing their repair products at "enthusiastic newbies". Yes, they will sell to anyone, but the repair stuff is clearly under the section labeled "For Technicians". You can buy scalpels from medical supply houses, but I don't think they suggest you perform your own brain surgery either.

I certainly don't want to discourage you from learning instrument repair, but major dent repair is not the place to start. You have to learn to walk before you run, so to speak... There are many types of flute body damage including dents (round or straight crease type), bends, twists, crushed, etc. As a repair tech, you need to know how to recognize each type and you need to know how to work each type without causing MORE damage to the instrument. Also, you need to realize that for major flute damage, the body is not the only thing that has to be repaired. Both the keys and the steels on which they rotate must also be straightened. Neither the Flute Station nor body mandrels will help with that. And before you can deal with those problems, you need to know about replacing pads and adjusting/regulating the mechanism...

There are several techs on here that are happy to answer repair questions (up to a point because that's not the focus of this board). If you want to learn more about repair, you may want to join the Yahoo group for Musical Instrument Technicians. It's free and open to anyone including amateurs. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/musical_i ... echnician/

Since you asked about flute blocks, why not consider making your own? Over at the Yahoo Musical Instrument Technician Group, you can find free plans in the files section to make your own for almost no cost.

[flutego12]

Again, I have them but dont use them.

I pretty much buy most tools I see from suppliers, its only through buying them do I know if it can improve me and my end product. 90 percent of the time I find the products are pretty and really of no use over convential tools. That is hammers rollers feller gauges screwdrivers etc.

Removing dents is a skill, that a simple roller wont achieve, When you work a bent side for example with a roller, you in fact stretch the metal in that plane, the stretched metal needs to be dispersed back into the flute, to achieve this you need to reverse bend with two mandrels, then you need to work areas opposite each other to equalise the stretched areas of metal, its a skill that simply rolling a bearing over a round block of steel wont replicate. The working of the metal also has to take into consideration the walls of the tone holes, the last thing you want is a ripple into a tone hole happening.

Again, my explanation is very simplified, and you should not attempt doing said process by my description alone.

Heeded. Realise that metalworks gets a lot more complicated beneath the surface - completely cooperative when beaten at the right angle and pressure but leads to endless other consequences when not - when I saw the introductory JLSCo video, the shiny FS was very beckoning, but yes, I wasn't entirely convinced about the rolling process - skill is acquired and tempered over long time. Nothing with haste. Leave it to the experts

[flutego12]

... the FS is such clever marketing it sells an attractive kit to enthusiastic newbies and offer a glimmer of hope that perhaps we too can attempt repairs. The set up is attractive though, I'm not sure about the manual pushing and pulling of the flute tube to iron out a dent I am disappointed to hear that as I thought it is very effective. How do you mean by "average for straigthening". Perhaps that's why its Out of Stock.

Can I ask what old techniques of dent removal and hj resizing do you employ?

What do you think of the pair of Flute Blocks currently sold for $56.

Hmm. I guess I don't see that JL Smith is marketing their repair products at "enthusiastic newbies". Yes, they will sell to anyone, but the repair stuff is clearly under the section labeled "For Technicians". Noted.You can buy scalpels from medical supply houses, but I don't think they suggest you perform your own brain surgery either. aha ...

I certainly don't want to discourage you from learning instrument repair, but major dent repair is not the place to start. You have to learn to walk before you run, so to speak... There are many types of flute body damage including dents (round or straight crease type), bends, twists, crushed, etc. As a repair tech, you need to know how to recognize each type and you need to know how to work each type without causing MORE damage to the instrument. absolutely, very aware of that, I totally agree Also, you need to realize that for major flute damage, the body is not the only thing that has to be repaired. Both the keys and the steels on which they rotate must also be straightened. Neither the Flute Station nor body mandrels will help with that. And before you can deal with those problems, you need to know about replacing pads and adjusting/regulating the mechanism...yes I realise the reason for the way training modules are offered in sequential progression (even Zevang at his level), mirrored in the courses being offered. but tempting though. It all gotten bigger than ben hur with the fallen headjoint... and the flute station (if it worked that is) seemed like good infra to build on w/o having to double up later on. Oh well. This is great advice though.

There are several techs on here that are happy to answer repair questions (up to a point because that's not the focus of this board). If you want to learn more about repair, you may want to join the Yahoo group for Musical Instrument Technicians. It's free and open to anyone including amateurs. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/musical_i ... echnician/
Rigth-eo and very thankful for that, techs! You guys are amazing. I will certainly check this out, thank you for the headsup PiedPiper!
Since you asked about flute blocks, why not consider making your own? Over at the Yahoo Musical Instrument Technician Group, you can find free plans in the files section to make your own for almost no cost.

Done. Application for membership submitted. Waiting of acceptance. btw I found an almost imperceptible dink on my hj the middle E and F was breaking unusually (as though greater harmonics!) requiring more control. felt slightly different - prefer the original. Which I could iron it out with the FS roller!!!