Repadding of Yamaha 200, 300 series flute

[pied_piper]

The idea is to get a throwaway that does NOT play and bring it back to life to understand the flute better. There just isn't many around.

I see a lot of clunker flutes for sale on eBay. Look for an older Artley or Armstrong or Bundy flute. As long as it is not missing any parts and is not bent like a boomerang or have other damage, either of those would be suitable for practicing repairs. I've seen some of those sell for $25-$50. If you are not successful with the repad, you are not out that much, but if you ARE successful, you'll have a working flute that you can take camping or other places where you might not want to play a good flute.

[ghostNote]

What makes for a better trill pad: a Cabernet Sauvignon or a Chardonnay? And when it comes to the shims how does Hermes stack up to Prestini?

[ghostNote]

And what about that tube in Valentino's kit? What's up with that? I mean, is it supposed to eliminate the hazard of a wine glass cluttering the flautist-turned-amateur-tech's work space or something?

Hey, not to go off on a tangent here, (but guess I'm going to anyhow), but did anybody see the C-foot case from Valentino that Smith offers? Looks like that photon-torpedo casket they used to launch Spock. Pretty cool!

[jim22]

I have repadded quite a few flutes, most very successfully. You need a few tools, an assortment of pads and shims, a good book, and an unbelievable amount of perseverence. Getting set up will cost more than getting one flute repaired professionally. If you have the patience, are good with your hands, think analytically, and act carefully, you may find it very rewarding. I love taking an unplayable flute and bringing it back to life. After the first couple, I now try to choose flutes that will be pretty nice when completed, no dents and a good finish. I have sold a few locally to young students.

I am currently using pads from instrumentclinicusa.com. it's not very practicle to buy pad sets. You should try to measure the inside diameter of the key cups for pad diameter and the buy one pad each .5 mm less and more. Then try the fit to select the sizes and order what you need to finish the flute. You probably need shims 17.0, 18.0, and 19.0 mm by .001, .003, .008 in. thick. Burkart and Phelan have an excellent book.

Advanced topics include bending keys to level them (pretty essential), leveling toneholes (I still struggle here), and partial shimming (controvercial, but I find it necessary, maybe because I haven't learned to level toneholes).

Start with the book!

Jim

[mirwa]

Do you run a flute or repair outlet, mirwa?

Yes

www.ultrainspections.com

However it's no good for you as we only do local work

[flutego12]

I have repadded quite a few flutes, most very successfully. You need a few tools, an assortment of pads and shims, a good book, and an unbelievable amount of perseverence. Getting set up will cost more than getting one flute repaired professionally. If you have the patience, are good with your hands, think analytically, and act carefully, you may find it very rewarding. I love taking an unplayable flute and bringing it back to life. After the first couple, I now try to choose flutes that will be pretty nice when completed, no dents and a good finish. I have sold a few locally to young students.

I am currently using pads from instrumentclinicusa.com. it's not very practicle to buy pad sets. You should try to measure the inside diameter of the key cups for pad diameter and the buy one pad each .5 mm less and more. Then try the fit to select the sizes and order what you need to finish the flute. You probably need shims 17.0, 18.0, and 19.0 mm by .001, .003, .008 in. thick. Burkart and Phelan have an excellent book.

Advanced topics include bending keys to level them (pretty essential), leveling toneholes (I still struggle here), and partial shimming (controvercial, but I find it necessary, maybe because I haven't learned to level toneholes).

Start with the book!

Jim

Hi Jim, Thanks for the tips. You're not incidentally Jim of premier-flutes are you? If so, I have you to thank for my Allegro. Love it! Still playing fantasticly after 17mths.

[flutego12]

Do you run a flute or repair outlet, mirwa?

Yes

http://www.ultrainspections.com
cool!
However it's no good for you as we only do local work

my loss.

[jim22]

No, I have nothing to do with Premier flutes. -- jim

[mirwa]

Info is easy, and there is plenty of people that know there stuff, jbutky is one of them as I have read many a reply on the repairers website in Delphi from him, and he is close to the top of his field in knowledge.

So pay close attention.

Regarding repairs, I have draws of junker flutes, but I will re-integrate an earlier reply, get a working flute to start with and just attempt to change onepad with anew one.

Until you do this, you cannot understand the concept / difficulty or ease this may present to you.

Regards

Steve

[flutego12]

Info is easy, and there is plenty of people that know there stuff, jbutky is one of them as I have read many a reply on the repairers website in Delphi from him, and he is close to the top of his field in knowledge.

So pay close attention.

Regarding repairs, I have draws of junker flutes, but I will re-integrate an earlier reply, get a working flute to start with and just attempt to change onepad with anew one.

Until you do this, you cannot understand the concept / difficulty or ease this may present to you.

Regards

Steve

Thanks Steve. Caution taken. WHat you suggest is a good idea. Just have to be able to put it back together again. I wonder what the hidden pitfall is that so many ppl cant. What am I missing?

[mirwa]

Its precision, and you would be surprised how hard it is for some people to get it right.

The pad must touch the tone hole rim at the same time with the lightest of pressure, the key should not wobble and have play, the tone holes should be level, cheat on any, and the instrument will play average not great, sometimes it will not play at all.

[Zevang]

Its precision, and you would be surprised how hard it is for some people to get it right.

The pad must touch the tone hole rim at the same time with the lightest of pressure, the key should not wobble and have play, the tone holes should be level, cheat on any, and the instrument will play average not great, sometimes it will not play at all.

Sooooo agreed

[pied_piper]

Agree with Mirwa. Many/most flute techs use very thin feeler material to check for equal seating 360° around the pad. This feeler material can be as thin as .001" or even .0005" if they are really particular. To put this into perspective, .0005 is less than the thickness of most human hairs.

After selecting a pad of the appropriate diameter and thickness, the procedure to install and seat each pad properly goes something like this:
1 Install pad in key cup and place light mark at key arm to indicate radial orientation
2 Mount key on flute body
3 close key and use feeler to inspect for places where pad contact with tone hole is heavy or light and mark the light spots
4 remove key from flute
5 remove pad from key cup
6 add or remove shims to adjust for heavy or light spots - some techs use partial shims for small areas
7 REPEAT above until the pad touches equally all around the tone hole.
8 REPEAT above for each pad on the flute...

There is MORE to the process than what I have described above, but that should give you an idea of the precision work required to repad a flute. This also does not describe the process required to regulate the interaction of various keys that must work together or close in unison with no lost motion.

[flutego12]

Its precision, and you would be surprised how hard it is for some people to get it right.

The pad must touch the tone hole rim at the same time with the lightest of pressure, the key should not wobble and have play, the tone holes should be level, cheat on any, and the instrument will play average not great, sometimes it will not play at all.

gulp!

I shall remember that. incidentally, I thought I'd be armed with a clunky by now but transaction was unsuccessful. The flute was a good candidate, really not in good shape, but could not justify the price, in case of stuff up on my part.

[flutego12]

Its precision, and you would be surprised how hard it is for some people to get it right.

The pad must touch the tone hole rim at the same time with the lightest of pressure, the key should not wobble and have play, the tone holes should be level, cheat on any, and the instrument will play average not great, sometimes it will not play at all.

Sooooo agreed

So er, how thick was your rim tester strip (feeler material)? Just wondering whether Landell used the very thin (for maestros), mid thin or entry level thin